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Azathoth returns
Azathoth returns
Comments: 5
davidbrinnen

29.03.2024, 14:54








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Small Living Room
Small Living Room

            

Small Living Room
Description: my attempt again in making interior's im practicing so i hope i improved a little this took like 5 hrs to render (many small radial lights i think) which sucks lol i removed most of the ambient glow the small table is a boolean in bryce and those picture's in the frame i made those in photoshop.
here's the non edited one http://archclan.deviantart.com/art/Living-Room-2-95221249 you can see what i edited its just a slight change
Added by: archclan
Keywords: living, room
Date: 08.19.2008 18:06
Hits: 3931
Downloads: 84
Rating: 0.00 (0 Vote(s))
File size: 146.9 KB
Previous image: Sponza



Author: Comment:
Render Man
Member

Join Date: 11.10.2007
Comments: 358
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Very big improvement over you last scene and yes those radials are a pain but well worth it. I am glad to see you took Rashad's advise on the ambient. This room could be just a tad brighter but I still think it looks great.
08.19.2008 18:25 Offline Render Man alreich_4 at msn.com
rashadcarter1
Admin

Join Date: 06.04.2006
Comments: 2610
-

As Renderman notes it is much improved over the last interior. I like everything that is happening here, except the glowing materials. With proper ambeint glow free materials this could look like an actual photograph.

Few people will be as honest and direct with you as I will about your lighting choices and the consequences. You probably have never heard someone talk this badly about the ambient channel over at deviant Art, you probably think I am in my own world on this issue and therefore ambient glow is okay, but I am not wrong about ambient glow being a force of flatness in Bryce renders. I am just the first to admit it openly and encourage users to avoid this feature when realism is the goal. Just becasue I am the first to speak badly of ambient glow in your renders does not make me wrong. Take my advice with a grain of salt and understand that I give this advice to everyone because it is good advice. I can see that you have taken my advice a few inches, but you still seem reluctant to take my advice fully. What I am saying is that you do not need any ambient glow whatsoever, not even a little bit. It should be obvious to you that ambient glow is a flat feature, 2 dimensional and flat. This flatness is counter to what a 3d image should be about. Your instinct to correct the darkness of shadows is surely right, but the implementation of the ambient channel takes more away than it adds. There are shadows missing and therefore depth and realism.

Okay, I do not want to come on too strong so I'll be quick. If your goal is realism then you have to think realistically to a certain extent. There is no ambient glow button in real life so what makes us think it will make a scene look real in a render? No ambient glow whatsoever should always be your starting point. Sadly, you will NEVER GET A REALSTIC RESULT FROM AMBIENT GLOW. The preset libraries are extremely misleading, do not fall for the ambient glow trap, it will keep your renders looking like cartoons and that is not what we want usually. A five hour render is nothing, absolutely nothing. You should not be afraid of a 5 hour render. Quality takes time and resources, you cannot rush quality. If a render takes a full day then one can begin to get worried about render time. This notion of a fast render will hinder your creativity and technical growth. Patience is essential to good lighting. If your patience allows try these 3 things:

1. Have confidence and willingness to break your old ambient glow habit. Remove all ambient glow from all materials, every single one, not even a glow of 1 or 2. "0" is the only rightr answer. Trust your radials or spotlights to provide real ambeint indirect light from multiple directions.

2. Do not disable the shadows cast from your direct lights. In order to create a 3d impression on a 2d surface like a computer screen or a sheet of paper, light, shadows, lines, and curves must be used. If you disable shadows you are taking away the viewers ability to interpret the image as 3d. Shadows are not your enemy, they are your friend in every single case.

3. Now comes the hard part, providing a "real" ambient light. You have already placed radials throughout the room and the impact is terrific. But as you note the render time increases with the number of lights, so keep the number minimal. You could do this in a few ways:
A. You could use just 6 spotlights as ambient and get the job done very well. Simply place a super flat round spotlight facing toward the center of the room along each of the four walls and the ceiling and floor. If a wall is blue then give its spotlight a slightly blue tint. Remember that the walls are supposedly reflecting the light from the overhead lamp. This bounce in what we are creating with the spots. This will give your models real light from all sides along with shadows. The spots will be very dim with soft edges and normal hard shadows for speed of render. This is fast and requires only 6 spots total, add in the single radial as the direct light inside the lamp and you have got realism with only 7 lights total!
B: Use radials as you have here, but try to place them so that they cover the room well, try to find a way to spread them evenly as possbile. It will require more radials than the spotlight method so the spots along the walls will be a faster render.

Sorry I went on for days again. I get passionate about lighting. Sorry if I freaked you out. Take the plunge, depart from the cartoonish ways of the ambient channel and your work will begin to look more natural and realistic. Best wishes.
08.19.2008 19:39 Offline rashadcarter1 rashadcarter1 at aol.com
richter
Member

Join Date: 04.15.2004
Comments: 1092
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I have nothing to add except to totaly agree with Rashad's comment. Heed this man's words for this is experience, experience that will pay off quite well if one is up to face the challenge that Is the realism . Good luck!
08.19.2008 21:38 Offline richter richter at cold-may.com
archclan
Member

Join Date: 08.01.2008
Comments: 242
Rashad

Little by little im Improving in Interior Renders and thanks for your pointers yeah i shouldnt have turned off the cast shadows I turned of the Ambient Glow on this so If my Radial light ill turn off their Cast shadows so They wont make Shadows in different shadows and the Direct lights ill turrn o ncast shadows right? and as for the items ill be turning the cast shadows also,

and no you did not freak me out :P
08.19.2008 22:55 Offline archclan arch_devol at yahoo.com http://www.archclan.deviantart.com
rashadcarter1
Admin

Join Date: 06.04.2006
Comments: 2610
-

Archclan,

Glad to know I have not discouraged you. I get the sense you are asking a question with your last post. If I understand correctly you are wondering how to reconcile the shadows you will get from multiple angles when all of the radial lights are casting shadows? I can only say that the direct lights as you likely already know will be much brighter in intensity that the indirect lights. This means that the deepest shadows will be those cast by the strong direct light. The indirect shadows are essential also even though the territory is new. The indirect shadows will be much dimmer but yes, they will still be there, but somehow the eye is forgiving of them once the intensity balance is properly achieved. Direct light intensity vs indirect light intensity. This balance and proportion tells us if the lighing is realistic in most cases. The more lights you use the less banding will occur. Think of it as a resolution issue. You can have a low res photo of your wedding cake or a high resl photo of it. Light is the same, the more lights the greater the light resolution and the greater the realism. But it is always suprising to me how often just a few lights can do almost everything we need.
08.19.2008 23:30 Offline rashadcarter1 rashadcarter1 at aol.com
Horo
Admin

Join Date: 05.26.2004
Comments: 4721
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Much improved. Rashad can get a bit exited about ambient but until now, nobody has proven him wrong. Quite to the contrary. Since he started going on about the evil of ambient, the quality of pictures you see on this site has greatly improved. If render time is an issue for you, rather set the document size smaller than sacrificing the number of lights you need. Ambient is, like low shadow intensity, a shortcut everybody notices. Take one step at the time, don't be hasty.
08.20.2008 17:47 Offline Horo h.-r.h.wernli at bluewin.ch https://www.horo.ch/


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